Culture has always been the backdrop for marketing, but in the next 25 years, can brands and creatives become true culture makers, or are they destined to follow? In this episode of Hard Refresh, host Andrés López-Varela is joined by Jonathan Harley (media and tech executive, ex-Canva/Twitter/60 Minutes), Tess Palmyre (Founder, Brandable), and Tim Duggan (Author and Chair, Digital Publishers Alliance) to unpack the stakes. 

From Trump tweeting about Cracker Barrel’s logo to the backlash against DEI, the panel weighs whether marketers can authentically shape culture, or if values-driven storytelling is the only ballast in increasingly turbulent times.

In this episode:

// Culture wars on fast forward
Tim points to the recent Cracker Barrel logo saga, where Trump’s tweets sparked boycotts, as proof brands are now reacting to culture instead of leading it.

// Purpose under pressure
Tess and Jonathan argue values can’t just be slogans; Target’s retreat from DEI vs. Costco’s consistency shows who survives cultural turbulence.

// Authenticity as ballast
Jonathan stresses that authenticity is grounded in values, not marketing spin, and is the only way brands can navigate volatile cultural seas in the digital age.

// Fragmentation VS mega-brands
Tim warns we may end up with “10 mega-brands and 10 million scraps” in future, while Jonathan highlights Canva and Red Bull as examples of brands acting like cultural institutions.

// Humanity shines through AI “slop”
Tess insists that even in a sea of sameness, audiences gravitate back to messy, human, imperfect stories and that those are the cracks where culture happens.

This episode was recorded on the traditional lands of the Whadjuk Noongar people, live at State of Social ’25.

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